So what do YOU want to see?

[Ramblinwomble]

Bigger hak packs !!!

with quivers, backpacks, and knee length chainmail

http://nwvault.ign.com/fms/Image.php?id=7022

http://www.robinsonworkshop.com/phpBB2/ ... ic.php?t=6

http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=ha ... il&id=4366

I'd also like to see a set of helmets that look like shadowed hoods so I can put my hood up when I'm being creepy (*snaps fingers* off you go Deph...)

[Oye99]

Haha, now there's an idea! Hehe that's not what I was saying, or at least trying to anyways, I meant er.. *points back to his comment about the hospital*

3. Just perhaps could the revive spawn point be moved to the hospital? It seems kind of odd to just appear in the Inn, and you could even consider the gold loss as a payment for your treatment.

Bigger Hak packs?? *moans* But they're already a big enough pain to install... *mumbles and goes to check out the links*

Ooh.. nice though.

[lankycheese]

I would like to see balance in PvP combat. Now I'm not a fool, I know that complete balance is impossible to get, but I would like balance to the point where one or two classes don't have complete dominance over the rest.

Now I consider myself an ok PvPer, I find it a great part of the game that I get quite a thrill from. But of course NWN is at heart a PvE game, Bioware did not have PWs in mind when they designed the game, and so PvP balance was left out. But here are a few of my ideas for balancing the game. Note that this is not a wine, just my views on how I think the game would become more fun over all. Take it how you wish.

Remove most, if not all pre expansion spells, I’m mainly looking in the mage direction, but some other classes have stupid things too that Bioware obviously did not think through.

The main ones I’m talking about are IGMS, Bigby’s Grasping Hand, and of course Acid Sheath. Here I spose many mages will cry out in horror, but these spells just take out the fun in PvP combat. Mages are supposed to be powerful and difficult to beat, yes, but not impossible. If a mage whacks on Acid Sheath, they don’t even have to lift a spell and all but the most beafy melee characters will lose. But it’s our protection against KD you say? You don’t need it at all! A good mage will not even let a melee character get close enough to pull off the KD, but that’s another lesson.

Knock Down. One of the most yelled at moves in the game. Devastating in the right hands. Now I’m going to steal an idea straight from Jimmy here, which is so good that I have to post it myself. Make KD have a Strength 15 requirement, and Improved KD, Strength 17. But alas apparently KD is hardcoded into the game and can not be touched. A shame because I think that would fix the issue right up.

Take Divine Favour away from Clerics, they don’t need this spell, they can be powerful enough as it is in melee, when they aren’t even supposed to be a melee class it seems silly for them to have it. It makes sense for Paladins to have it, but if you must, take it away from them too, aslong as you leave the divine feats for them, or increase Smite Evil to 5x per day at level 20.

While we’re on the topic of Paladins, get rid of Holy Sword. Damn this is a cheap spell that takes away the part of the glory of earning one in a single push of a button. I’ve heard rumours it might be getting changed, or has been changed, I should test that… And as I said above, increasing Smite Evil to 5x per day at level 20 would be cool, but I think I’m pushing my luck there. I know I am biased, but personally I think a Paladin should be very powerful against evil characters, I’ll be hypocritical here and say even with a slight edge, but against good and neutral characters, mediocre at best. That would be a dream world for the Paladin, but I doubt that will happen.

They are just a few of my ideas for balance, I’m placing main emphasis on Acid Sheath, worst spell ever, and those other mage spells. Pre expansion mages were the best!

[Muletang]

i like it, but could never, would never agree with anything regarding those charlatans called Paladins....but thats just plain personal
----
I'd also like to say no to random casting of see invisibility, and general buffing, in the village when you see someone of a more dubious nature log in, with the excuse of 'i sense something amis'.
Loads of people do it, and I saw a prime example the other day whilst sitting around with one of my other characters and a fellow N'Asti logged in.

*poof* the air filled with buffs.

We always give warning before attacks, we play nice, give us a chance - its hard enough as it is.

[Evelond Formos]

Schools- I would like to see a school for all ages and races (well a separate school for drow and duegar of course )

Because you have to think: how did people get so smart in Dasaria without going to a school of some sort?

[Mon-Da-Oth]

Home education and the school of hard knocks.

To keep it within a Medieval type of genre the churches would have provided education to most of the populace. Trade guilds made sure that traders and crafters had enough knowledge to make a decent product and to market it and accademies taught millitary skills of course you had to be able to pay for most of it either through a sponser or your own families estate.

These structures already exsist in Dasaria but they lack a formailized method of "teaching". Most just assume that they are trained in what ever profession they picked.

[Peregrinus]

As to pre-expansion spells, here's the biggest problem, the most powerful pre-expansion combat spell, as far as I can tell, was Horrid Wilting. Now, technically Delayed Blast FB (1D8 per lvl) does as much damage as HW, however, HW's save was much more difficult to make and also a much rarer save to make than a Rflx. From everything I've seen in PvP Horrid Wilting is better than DBFB.

Why does this matter to me? RP-reasons. As it stands, all mages load up on Necromancy spells, even taking spell focus necromancy, simply because the necro school has the most powerful combat oriented spells in NWN. (Between Horrid Wilting, Finger of Death and Wail). Where does that leave those folks who can't or won't use necromancy? Basically as second rate mages who can't hold their own in any circumstances.

As to damage shields, take them out for all I care, they are pretty cheap and frankly I could care less, cast your offensive spells to get kills damnit.

However, as to LGMS and IGMS, if they are that henious, then take a look at the lvl 6 spell from actual DnD rather than NWN. You think IGMS is bad? Disintergrate. Same exact damage as IGMS, except that its single target and if you take any damage from it at all, make a fort save or, well, die.

Honestly, my biggest reason for disagree about IGMS et all is not for PvP reasons, I know I can beat Til with only a lvl 3 spells and some metamagic feats (Quickened Flame Arrow, Max Flame arrow, wash, rinse repeat, one dead Pally standing at my feet.). But for PvE reasons, namely Varanite Claw Assassins and Talon Scouts. Both are completely immune to death effects and mind effects, have evasion, and insanely high rflx saves. Without IGMS, basically mages can do jack against them, as they'll dodge everything you throw at them and you can't just drop them with a death spell. I can hear most meleeists scorning this as just mages wanting to be overpowered, but think on this a lvl 20 meleeist has very little problem going up against five Talon Scouts and beating them senseless, as it stands now, alone, five Talon Scouts have a damn good chance of dropping me, if you removed the expansion combat spells, well then, two Talon scouts could turn me to mincemeat.

Now, to Bigby's. I never quite understood the gripe about them. The damage dealing ones don't deal all that much damage, and Grasping Hand, so long as you make the fort save, doesn't stun you, you can still fight, just not get in the mage's face, pull out a bow if you have to. As far as I can tell, BGH works exactly the same as it does in PnP (I might be wrong, been a while since I looked at the PHB for it). Now, if you want to pull them, I have to say, as soon as you pull out KD, because as soon as a mage is hit with KD it is over for the mage. KD cancels out any spell-casting ongoing (even if you make the concentration check against the damage), and with every fighter and rogue worth their salt taking it, the only way not to get KD spammed to death is to keep the opponent out of range, all considering, there are really only three spells that can effectively do this: Hold Person, Hold Monster and Grasping Hand. And with Belts of Agility as common as water on Dasaria, the only one that's really effective is Grasping Hand, and since that only immobalizes rather than paralyzes, you can still fight and do things.

[Kell]

RP reasons?

How about we go look back at the original descriptions for the different spell schools aye?

Necromancy, isn't that to feign, destroy and control life? So wouldn't it be logical then, in opposite to for instance.. transmutation, it has the most powerful spells where it comes to creating and destroying life? I do believe so.

If you're talking about RP reasons for not taking Necromancy as your favored class, well then you should look at the school descriptions and find out what is typical for the class you chose. Some schools just aren't meant to destroy life, like Divination. Divination is mainly about gathering information. Kinda odd would it be there if there would be great destructional spells for that school then.

So yeah. Most people turn to Necromancy for the lethal spells. It's what the school is for. If you don't want to use Necromancy for RP reasons, expect to be not as strong in your spells then. Unless you are an evocator.

[Kell]

And Horrid Wilting is an awesome spell in pvp, if you don't mind your partymembers ending up dead as well.

Ahaaah, I loved the times when we battled in a big group against group fight, and I was one of the few ones left standing because I killed everybody with two horrid wiltings after one another, killing everybody including the party I fought with. Good times.

IMGS doesn't require any saves. I can imagine people are miffed about it. 240 dmg in one blow can be... well... unfair, heheh. Desintegration still requires a save on death. IMGS has none. Not even spell resistance, if I recall correctly.

About the claw.. well.. that is what you have those sheaths for! You can't hurt them, so let them beat you and hurt themselves. That's the whole idea behind those sheaths anyways. In pvp they aren't fair. But what else are you supposed to do against enemies who really aren't affected by anything else, where it comes to pve?

[Peregrinus]

IGMS is affected by SR... trust me, I curse it every time I fight Raven, since max IGMS is about the only spell I can hurt her with.

Now, I agree the lack of a save is what makes IGMS a bit overpowered, however, if you gave it a rflx, then again, mages have nothing against it.

To balance it, I might suggest actually giving it a fort save for half damage. This maintains its strength overall, but also weakens it significantly, especially against the characters with the highest HP.

[lankycheese]

But for PvE reasons, namely Varanite Claw Assassins

Claw are not supposed to be defeated with a few spells! Every other class has to use team work and sacrifices to beat one of these, why the hell should mages be able to down them in 2 or 3 spells? And with your complaint about only being able to use Horrid Wilting, mate, you said yourself you beat me with level 3 spells, mages have a bloody $#!% load of spells! There are more tactics out there then just TIME STOP, IGMS, or GRASPING HAND, IGMS! Fire Brand, Cone of Cold, Fire ball and delayed Fire ball. Bloody hell there are too many to list, there is no possible way you can complain about that you are only left with necromancy.

And grasping hand, is not a Fortitude save. If you do not have Freedom on, you are completely immobilised. If you have freedom you can still attack if they get close or with a bow. But doesnt matter anyway, I've worked out now getting immunity to mind spells stops it, but if you cast freedom it will override that immunity and you will still get caught.

And back to the PvE argument, what is it with you mages and thinking you are supposed to be able to own the living crap out of everything? Send down a couple of ice storms, a cone of cold and finish off with a fire brand and you will fry those Talon. What's the matter, can't solo them? Well neither can everyone else.

[Peregrinus]

Lanky, I explained, quite clearly, my point. I do not think I have the right to own anything, you missed a critical point to my post.

Every spell you mentioned, and every other damaging spell in the game with the exception of necromancy and the missile spells (MM, ILMS, IGMS), all have a Reflex save. I repeat: ALL, take a look yourself. When you remove IGMS end-game mages without necromancy involved in PvE become nothing more than fancy buff-dispenser for everyone else, since they cannot hurt a damn thing.

Talon Scout and Claw Assassins have Evasion, and a ridiculously high Rflx save. They make this save most of the time against Falson, even with his 32 Cha. Add their equipment making them immune to death and mind effects, I am basically worthless and cannot defeat even one without a good spot of luck. With a Max IGMS, yes I can drop a single Talon scout in one round, at the same time, I've seen many fighter bases do the same thing with a crit, and most fighters can tear apart a Talon scout in all of ten seconds flat. I've seen fighters take on five plus Talon scouts and come out on top, myself, I have to play it very carefully to take out a group of five (meaning get into range under invis, probably should timestop, drop a few IGMS and pray that my 50% miss chance from invis keeps me alive through the rain of arrows.)

Again, yes, in one on one PvP IGMS is overpowered, but frankly, I could give a rats' ass about PvP balance, especially if it means loosing the PvE balance, which is exactly what you're demanding.

[lankycheese]

I've been reading the manual this afternoon having a good hard look at all the mage spells available. If Max IGMS is the only thing you can think to use against those high reflex save enemies, then damn. Infact I'm becoming so itnerested in all these spell options, that I'm going to make a mage of my own to test out ideas I have of different spell combinations.

I refuse to believe IGMS is the only useful thing against high reflex save enemies. And just off the top of my head, arn't you an avid user of weird? Wouldn't that be even more useful against the Talon then IGMS? Once again I'm not sure, I'm just throwing around ideas here, but it seems the sorc and the wizard are two classes that have the greatest diversity with regards to tactics, and by making a few changes, will encourage people to be alot more diverse then just having a hundred bright blue lights traveling towards the enemey.

Also I've been pondering more on Bigby's Grasping Hand, and rather then just removing it, I would say just give it a decent save so that it becomes less of an 'I Win' button against melee, but is still effective. A Will or Fort save would make sense methinks.

[DM Chicken Little]

Ahem...the debate over spells, min/max use of them, and what is RP and what is not for casters has been beaten to death....and is NOT the point of this thread.

Please move it along, or take it to a more appropriate thread. This is about what you want to see, ideas to make it better, not to have this discussion again.

DMCL

[Oye99]

Hey, would it be possible to implement a small system where a small amount of xp is granted for the disablement of traps, or when a lock is picked, by rogues? It only makes sense I supose, eh?

I mean, you know the saying, practice makes perfect, and since it's a skill, it would kinda seem obvious that the more you do it, the better you would become.

Of course.. you could always apply the same to pickpocketing too .