Paladins in concept

jekyl81 · Post by **jekyl81** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 1:33 am

Jimmy wrote:Isn't Anu the god of Law and Order? As well as god of the sky, and being the creator of Marduk.

As far as I know there isn't a single god that preaches balance in the Dasarian Pantheon.

If theres no god of balance... can we get one? and since i suggested it, can i name him? ... if i can... i want him to be called Bob

Jecht Borino · Post by **Jecht Borino** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 1:52 am

yes yes " all hail god "bob "

Holly · Post by **Holly** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:25 am

I think that's part of why Eriq and Walker brought Asher about.

Actually, that might be why Asher brought Eriq and Walker about.

ironchicken · Post by **ironchicken** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 3:05 am

This is quite a good overview of Nergal and Erishigal. There is another stoiry I have in a book at home that describes how a warrior returns from Nergals domain and talks of his time there. Because he was a warrior Nergal judge him and made his existance pleasurable.

http://www.meta-religion.com/World_Reli ... hkigal.htm

3.1 talks about him as a judge and tester.

Winky Willis · Post by **Winky Willis** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 4:15 am

Fera is my personal favourate good guy in Dasaria at present. Whether we all agree if a paladin of Ki is playable or not.. I personally think it is I'd like to make a few observations on Fera and how he has broadened my gaming experience greatly.

Fera is very benevolent.. rather than have the attitude your evil die.. he asks the question your evil why? This makes him a very intriguing character and he quickly bounced of my two Nergalites brilliantly. Meldvion mentioned in an earlier posts that he sees the Nergalites in comparison as the Orcs of Lord of the Rings, this couldn't be any further from the truth in the case of both my two current Nergalites. Winky has tricked by Nergal into joining him so she could use his power to avenge her dead father and Ebenezer was blackmailed by Sable.. become undead or join Nergal as a foot soldier.

I think I can say that Fera actually sees Ebenezr and Winky for what they truely are pawns of Nergal. Fera has used his charisma on both my charaters greatly.. he squirmed a confession out of Winky into her reasons for hunting elves of Rian. Ebenezer actually admires Fera at present.. the last time they argued they dueled in the pit Fera won, Ebenezer sees him as a skilled and honourable warrior, Fera then kept to his word and completed his promise to the Nergalite Lords. Ebenezer is lawful evil.. he considers Fera his better, he won't attack him unless a Lord tells him too or his opinion changes.

Using his wisdom, benevolence and charisma... has made Fera one of the most unique characters I have roleplayed with.

ironchicken · Post by **ironchicken** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 6:56 am

Agreed Winky, as I said above, I think Fera is a great Pally and the way he plays a pally suggests the way a pally could be played for other non-LG alignment gods. Honour, respect, chivalry, dedication, etc.

I think there is room for the SMITE EVIL! SMITE EVIL! SMITE EVIL! form of pally but that is not the end of the class. If it was it would be a shame. What about the SMITE CHAOS! SMITE CHAOS! SMITE CHAOS! pally or the spiritual teacher and patron or the pious honourable knight whom draws power from his own soul...

Romar has very different relationships with Meldvion, Holly and Fera. Understanding those relationships is core to the way he is played. I enjoy all three because all three give me a different way to bounce my RP off them and the world.

Post by **jhr4n** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 8:43 am

I have nothing against the character or the player. I'm sure it will be interpreted that way I'll say it up front and again at the end: I have nothing against the character or the player.

But, as a paladin, Fera is something of a failure. He is a big disappointment to Ki and all the other gods. He consorts with evil constantly, and has yet to get one of them to come around. He's sold his elven friends into a pact with Nergal while assisting Kell and Maelstrom in their dark schemes. People he has saved? Zero.

When I have jumped to Fera in the past, the odds are around 4:1 that he is negiotiating with criminals, or rewarding them for taking hostages, that is, if he is not activly working for them, fetching them sacred relics from his own temple or something similar. Honestly, lets look at this big picture, god-eye-view. Evil has flourished in his wake.

Sure it's been a lot of fun for team-evil to RP with him, but by any objective measure, he is a terrible paladin. I realize that team-evil is having a blast playing along while he repeatedly plays into their hand. I have no doubt that evil characters wish all paladins were like Fera because lets face it - they would do quite well.

I also realize that is mainly because all the player's friends are playing Nergalites and that's all that is online to RP with. I understand that, I do. But if I didn't know that, and I was just looking in totally IC, I would say - get this guy out of my church before he does me any more favors.

That doesn't mean he's not a good player or a good character. He's just not helping team-good along. If I were a knight off saving the princess and Fera wanted to join up, I would be like - Ummm, naahh, that's ok. I'm just going to kill the dragon and save the girl, I don't really feel like bargining her release by stealing the villiage soul-stone and releasing the trapped demon which nearly destroyed civilization 3 eons ago. Because, you know, I'd just be sending him the message anytime he needs me as his paladin slave-puppet all he has to do is kidnap another girl.

I have nothing against the character or the player. I'm sure it will be interpreted that way I'll say it up front and again at the end: I have nothing against the character or the player.

Kell · Post by **Kell** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 9:30 am

Well, Fera'Vanna -has- fallen from grace -and- is no longer favoured by Ki, as far as I know.

That's what he gained over all his false practises. And I think he's going to have to do a -lot- to actually become a decent paladin again. And if he doesn't shape up, well..

On the other hand, Fera'Vanna has kept his word and did act out of what he thought was good.

He might be a failure but he has kept his word. Which does make him seem an honorable man imho...

IC, Kell gained respect for him, solely for him keeping his word. Something that was -not- expected.

I suppose that still though, in the form of a paladin, it doesn't matter much if evil gains respect for the paladin, but it does matter that that paladin kept his word (I can't repeat that often enough, so it seems, forgive me.)

He made a choice, thought it was best and lived through the consequences. That takes courage.

Fera'Vanna Rilynn'lylth · Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:04 am

Heh....wow

Well J4's compleatly right in a way Fera is a faliure as a Paladin, which is why he has lost his powers, ok the game engine dosnt allow it....but I dont use them or his sword. Fera came to the village seeing things as Black and white....now he sees the greys, but one thing as kell points out, no matter what ,he keeps his word, he has made mistakes and now lives with them. Fera may not even regain his Paladin powers, its still up in the air which direction it will go

OOC I made the deal with the nergalites to help them out with a huge storyline that is still in the running, why ? because of the huge amount off effort they put into the server, only to have there plans destroyed by the rule "evil never wins". So I picked up the quest that had nearly died and got invloved, to help move it on.

Winky Willis · Post by **Winky Willis** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 10:27 am

One thing thats interesting me in this whole post and has started to raise questions. J4 mentions team evil and team good... even though the Nergalites are all evil some are Lawful as obviously Fera is.. if he gains enough respect from within the Nergalite group.. and say one day a Lawful Nergalite takes command which isn't unbelievable... Fera could save far more lives than the stereotypical sword waving crush all evil type paladin using the power of negotiation and simple word. For all Fera's faults he is gaining trust.. Kell, Romar and Ebenezer have all stated they "trust" him which in future confrontrations could be invaluable.

Post by **jhr4n** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 11:36 am

Fera -
Heheheh - I'm glad you understand my point.. I enjoy Fera a lot myself, he's a good character - everyone likes playing with him and that is what matters. The character is a success even if he -has- failed his god and country. That failing is part of his story. I'm sure I'm not the only one wondering how it will turn out :) I am completly in-tune with the way you play the character.

Winky -
I think you know what I said is accurate. Quit rationalizing, it's ludicrous.

Kell is wanted for murder. Kell -is- a murderer. A mass-murderer. A Bride-slayer even, and(!) has committed many other crimes, including treason. Working with/for him is not a good thing to do no matter how you try to spin it.

Kell · Post by **Kell** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 11:49 am

jhr4n wrote:Kell is wanted for murder. Kell -is- a murderer. A mass-murderer. A Bride-slayer even, and(!) has committed many other crimes, including treason. Working with/for him is not a good thing to do no matter how you try to spin it.

Now, now, is there need to make me look -that- bad?! You shouldn't just talk bad about people, they wont like you for that you know.

ironchicken · Post by **ironchicken** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 12:15 pm

Fera'Vanna Rilynn'lylth wrote:Heh....wow

Well J4's compleatly right in a way Fera is a faliure as a Paladin, which is why he has lost his powers, ok the game engine dosnt allow it....but I dont use them or his sword. Fera came to the village seeing things as Black and white....now he sees the greys, but one thing as kell points out, no matter what ,he keeps his word, he has made mistakes and now lives with them. Fera may not even regain his Paladin powers, its still up in the air which direction it will go

OOC I made the deal with the nergalites to help them out with a huge storyline that is still in the running, why ? because of the huge amount off effort they put into the server, only to have there plans destroyed by the rule "evil never wins". So I picked up the quest that had nearly died and got invloved, to help move it on.

got a baby on lap so typing not great... yes thanks fera ooc you did help us out but ic romar goaded you into it... -so your word is worthless paladin?- -just because your god has let you off does not mean you are released... or do you no longer stand instead of shalandra?- etc. it was the right ic (and ooc) thing to do. i will write better when i have more than one finger.

Winky Willis · Post by **Winky Willis** » Fri Aug 20, 2004 12:43 pm

J4 I didn't say you aren't accurate in my post. I agree with you that Fera has failed as a paladin I was trying to defend his stance of using negotiations. A paladins prime requiste is charisma and I just really liked Fera's use of words before violence to try and solve the worlds problems. As he has found out to his own cost that it isn't fool proof and he has fallen from grace a career hazard for paladins. If Dasaria's Paladins all use violence to solve all their disagreements then so be it. I have no problem with that I just liked Fera's take on using a different tactic. I don't think he is the perfect Paladin.. just very interesting to roleplay with.

By the way I do think Paladins should all follow a goodly god.